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Hi everyone. This is for discussion of April's group book:
Children of Time by Adrian Tchaikovsky
This won the 2016 Clarke award.

Unless it’s a very general comment make sure you use spoiler code.
< spoiler>Comment< /spoiler> Without the spaces.

The 2017 Clarke award short list will be announced on May 3rd so it seemed the ideal time to read the current winner of it.

1 - Genesis

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An interesting start and premise. Seeding new worlds with life and then that life wipes itself out; a grand and dramatic start.
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Pilgrimage

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So these ancestors of humanity must be from some far flung outpost and it took them awhile to get back to Eaarth where they then cannabalzied what they could of remaining technology and set out to find Earth 2. I know I’ve encountered this idea before somewhere but can’t remember where.

Then they come across the distress bouy that was deployed which Doctor Kern is relying on to get her help. Extreme isolation has left her with only her own mind and thoughts to think with, nothing social at all. Even in the stasis or cryogenic state she’s been in you do get the impression she’s been aware at times, possibly low level consciousness over a long time. The spider at the end taking out the last drone was impressive and made me smile; really proving how advanced and far life has progressed.

The spider chapters were unexpected but did work well. Curious to see if the spiders are the other race mentioned on the back of the book as the other race that wants this planet. In theory it should be apes if Kern’s experiment is anything to go by but we’ll see soon enough.
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1 - Genesis

(view spoiler)[Great start to this book.

Dr Kern, blinded by her own brilliance, reaped her rewards. I disliked her the minute she showed up.

I liked Portia, much to my surprise. I wasn't too sure about the spiders but this might be fun. (hide spoiler)]

3 - War

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So a fight for both the human crew and the spiders on the planet. Definitely an interesting concept and not something I’ve come across in quite this way before. The speed of evolution of the spiders and ants is accelerated by the nanite technology intended to be used on the apes. I’m curious if the apes have survived somewhere on the planet. Is this planet like Earth in the early Pan Gaiai aspect days or is it like we are now, islands all over? Knowing that will introduce other species, like the apes, or not.

I have little empathy with the human crew members so far but do still like the book however. This isn’t a character based story so will be interesting to see where it goes.
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4 - Enlightenment

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So the spiders have suffered from a plague and finally discover how to access the programming within themselves and evolve themselves at will, kind of anyway. I expected something like this to happen after their success in the last chapter. The immortal line of Portia is an interesting way to continue a more focused and character driven idea of the spider evolution forward.

The captain has discovered the technology that makes Doctor Kern what she is and is presumably trying to access it for himself; does he think he can become some sort of immortal mind guiding mankind. A twisted version of god to his mind?

This is weird but I am enjoying it.
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2 - Pilgrimage

(view spoiler)[ I am enjoying the fact that although the humans are advanced enough to have an ark ship, they are still well behind the technology of their ancestors. Here they are in conflict with their ancestors instead of some new alien species.

I almost felt bad for Dr Kern. Almost.

The spider chapters are fun. Still a little surprised about this. Interesting to see their technology and the ants. (hide spoiler)]

3 - War

(view spoiler)[Conflicts for both the spiders and the humans. The spider v ant war was very entertaining and I thought the solution was elegant.

The human conflict wasn't as entertaining but it will be interesting to see how it affects the overall story. My only complaint about the story so far was how the mutineer Bales just seemed to step outside the shuttle with no concerns. If I'm stepping onto an alien planet for the first time I'm going to be a bit more careful. Weren't those ants 10 - 12 inches long? Tough to miss if you're paying attention. Made for a great scene though.

I'm also waiting to see if the spiders ever advance enough to communicate with the satellite. That could really complicate matters for the humans. Hahaha. (hide spoiler)]

Joe,
(view spoiler)[ I thought all of the primates/monkeys/apes burned up entering the atmosphere. I could be wrong though. Funny you mentioned the crew members. I don't care much for them either except for Holsten. The captain comes across as a real prick. I wonder if that was done so that we would identify more with the spiders? (hide spoiler)]

5 - Schism

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I really enjoyed this section. The spider's story I’m far more interested in than the humans now which seems an odd thing to say. The spider chapters here were mixed point of view for the first time; between Portia and Fabian. This was a curious development but one that was definitely needed. I was starting to think would there be others as with the human chapters there’s only ever been the one so far.

The human crew chapters are good but just don’t seem to hold my interest as much. Cleverly written to make you almost change your mind and view on Guyen; but like Holsten you realise what Guyen is really like and up to.
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Jon

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That does seem familiar actually so you're likely right. I'm curious if it was on purpose with the captain being so unpleasant.
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4 - Enlightenment

(view spoiler)[Spiders and humans both make technological jumps here, both based off of the old human tech. I like Holsten's concern that everyone is advancing along the lines of the original humans and not breaking off to carve their own path. His concern is that they are doomed to make the same mistakes and ultimately fail.

A plague from the point of view of spiders isn't something you come across very often. Very cool.

As a side note, this author wrote the Shadows of the Apt series. I haven't read it but it too has something to do with insects/bugs/flying things. (hide spoiler)]

Joe,
(view spoiler)[It seems like we're both enjoying the spider sections, which I must admit still surprises me a little. I noticed that in this section the males became slightly more involved and I'm interested to see what if anything changes. I'm also wondering if we're headed for a big human v spider war or if the two parties can break from their past and work things out. I assume one of those two is where we're headed.

Captain Guyen does seem to be following along Dr Kern's path. While Kern didn't seem to want to be some kind of computer god, just a human god, it looks like Guyen might be actively striving towards it. (hide spoiler)]

5 - Schism

(view spoiler)[Well one of my questions was answered fairly quickly. Fabian is out to change things in the spider's culture.
Both cultures suffer from internecine strife in this section. In both camps it is religious in nature and precipitated by a human trying to set itself up as a god or as godlike.
Fabian and Bianca seem to want to break away from the path being set up for them by Dr Kern, much as Holsten would like the humans to start carving their own path and to stop relying on the past.
I hate to imagine what kind of shape that ark ship is in. It's been traveling the stars for thousands of years now. (hide spoiler)]

6 - Zenith / Nadir

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A short section but an interesting one; especially for the spiders.The spiders have now started trying to reach space and reach Doctor Kern, who herself has now realised and accepted what they are and is now trying to help them the best she can. It’s interesting how the spiders have advanced their use of silk, being spiders they’ve been given that extra boost up to a new stage.

Holsten is now out of the pod for yet another brief moment and finds out he has a potential daughter, in embryo form, with Lain. He’s been forced again to go back in a pod and help them when they’re landing on the planet and therefore help his future daughter out. Odd idea but it works well.

Kern is becoming something different too, just like her spiders.
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7 - Collision

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The last full length section and definitely an interesting one. I didn’t know how the encounter between humans and spiders would go but spiders in space is not something I’d have ever considered

Each section has very slowly narrowed the differences between human and spiders chapters I feel. It seems like there’s less and less between them as species now; though still an obvious unsurmountable gap.
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8 - Diaspora & overall thoughts

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So the nanovirus worked and now humans and spiders have combined as cooperative species rather than competing. I like how this uses the well known curiosity of mankind and extends it to the now uplifted spiders.

I need time to think about it a little more.
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6 - Zenith/Nadir

(view spoiler)[The spiders finally reach for space and Kern is forced to accept that they are not what she had dreamed them to be. I like how although she is constantly trying to control them they have been able to keep their autonomy.

Holsten is almost like a camera in this book. Through him we see different snapshots of time on the ship. While time remains slow for him it passes quickly for the ship and the people on board. Every few days for him there is a jump where generations have passed for the ship and some of it's inhabitants. And while at the beginning of the book he was the oldest person on the ship members of the Key Crew have now passed him by while others have lived full lives while he slept. Most importantly Lain. That would mess with your head a bit. (hide spoiler)]

7 - Collision

(view spoiler)[Someone should make this book into a movie just for this last section. There were parts that seemed like a horror movie and reminded me a bit of Aliens. I would love to see the planet from space surrounded by the webbing. I really enjoyed this section and the final reveal. (hide spoiler)]

8 - Diaspora
(view spoiler)[I liked the way it ended. Everything wrapped up nicely but you could write a sequel if you wanted to. (hide spoiler)]

I enjoyed this book waaaay more than I thought that I would. I wasn't looking forward to reading a 600 page book about spiders and I almost skipped it. So glad that I didn't. It was a fairly quick read too. It seemed like every time that I sat down with it I knocked out 100-150 pgs without even trying.

Jon, I agree with it being a remarkably easy book to just pick up and read another big section of. It could appear intimidating to people but it's less severe than at first look.

I found out this week that Adrian Tchaikovsky is working on the sequel to this novel. It looks like he has almost finished a rough draft. Really looking forward to this!

I heard about this too and it sounds like it could be rather interesting. Curious about where he could take events after the ending.

Jon wrote: "5 - Schism

Well one of my questions was answered fairly quickly. Fabian is out to change things in the spider's culture.
Both cultures suffer from internecine strife in this section. In both camp..."

(view spoiler)[I joined the group about mid-way through this book so I will start commenting here. It's funny but until now I was not particularly entertained by the spider chapters. I was not too fond of the precise rotation between spider and human chapters. I feel time-lapse is poorly depicted in the spider chapters... you just kind of find/figure out that this is now a new "Portia" or "Bianca". Also, Portia is supposed to be a part of the scientific name for the type of spider so why is it also the name of one particular spider and their lineage while not the other spiders? Anyways... I am enjoying the book, the spider chapters were a bit of a drag and the human chapters are decent. Overall a bit of a slow burn for me but now things are reaching a sort of climax so I am excited to see where the author takes this story. I kept expecting engagement between the humans and spiders but that was short-lived so perhaps now with Gilgamesh returning... or am I in for another twist? We shall see. (hide spoiler)]

Mike wrote: "I kept expecting engagement between the humans and spiders but that was short-lived so perhaps now with Gilgamesh returning... or am I in for another twist? We shall see."

I will bite my tongue and let you wait and see! :D

Nick wrote: "Mike wrote: "I kept expecting engagement between the humans and spiders but that was short-lived so perhaps now with Gilgamesh returning... or am I in for another twist? We shall see."

I will bite..."

(view spoiler)[ Alright, finished reading this. What can I say but that the mental gymnastics I had to overcome with space-faring spiders and all sorts of actions that defied physics and logic were redeemed by the surprise ending? The arachnids' sympathetic stance in the end proved that they have more humanity than humans themselves... as we would not have done the same and weren't going to. That bumped the book up from a 3 to a 4/5 for me. Looking forward to the current read of Hyperion now... (hide spoiler)]

Mike wrote: "Alright, finished reading this. What can I say..."

I felt the same way about the ending! Really makes it a great book - I think Tchaikovsky is an interesting thinker.

Glad you enjoyed it Mike! I thought the second book was quite good also. I need to read the third book but since it's been so long since I read the first two I'm afraid I should reread them first. And so I push that decision down the road.