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This thread is to discuss October's group read Neuromancer.

I'm planning to re-read this one after i've finished Hyperion. I read it when I first came out and to be honest I don't remember liking it very much. I know this is always on a lot best sci-fi lists so it will be good to read again and see if my taste has changed.

So, I originally read this in the very late 80s / very early 90s. At the time it blew me away - I had literally never read anything like it.

Now, the best part of 25 years later I think it still holds up pretty well. Some of it is now quite dated and overly familiar (the Blade Runner curse) as there are dozens of tropes that kicked off here, but I don't think it feels that "old" per se.

One thing I did find interesting is that I remembered an awful lot of the world-building, but had major gaps as far as some of the plot went.

Jo wrote: "I'm planning to re-read this one after i've finished Hyperion. I read it when I first came out and to be honest I don't remember liking it very much. I know this is always on a lot best sci-fi lis..."

I'm hoping I'll have a chance to reread it too, because I didn't like it much the first time around either. I read it in the early 90's, I think. I managed to pick up a PBO a few years ago really cheap at a con and wanted to reread it since then, just never had a good excuse to pull me in like this. It was an Ace Science Fiction Special. There were a lot of really good books that came out of that program around the same time. Probably the best was Lucius Shepard's Green Eyes. Has anyone else here read it? Kim Stanley Robinson's first book, The Wild Shore was also part of the series. So was Michael Swanwick's In the Drift. A pretty amazing bunch of books.

I'm currently reading The Last Coin for a meetup group, so hopefully after that I can consider Neuromancer. I have to admit, I liked Hyperion even less and I'm not much interested in rereading it. Maybe some day.

I read this when it first came out - not the very first edition, but an Ace Special. I remember because I recently ran across the other book I bought at the same time, Green Eyes.

That was 30 years ago, the year my youngest boy was born. At that time, we didn't even have a VCR & the only computer I'd ever played with was the main frame at the University of Maryland. A very brief tour of it & a game of 'gravity' or something similar. Pong was available, but I don't think my BIL had gotten his Timex Sinclair yet. Lunar Lander loaded via my old reel to reel tape recorder over a 10 or 15 minute period. I think the screen held about a dozen characters max. The Internet wasn't called that & few even knew about it. BBS's weren't around.

The idea of computer talking to each other across a network wasn't totally SF, but close. This book blew me away then. It opened up an entirely new world & genre.

The last time I tried to read it, it fell flat, though. Part is the dialect has been done & over done. I read quite a few cyberpunk novels in the 90's. Like vampires, it just got old. I'll try it again soon.

David, I missed your comment about the Ace Special & "Green Eyes". Wow. Great minds, eh? Here's my review of Green Eyes, in case you're interested.
/review/show...

I read Neuromancer about two years ago and I can hardly remember it. I know it is a milestone in SF and a genesis of the cyberpunk genre, but it just didn't do it for me.

I read it right after reading Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas and this was my breif review:
Neuromancer is like reading a dream. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Gibson wrote this while on a high speed ride in a Cadillac convertible with Hunter Thompson and his attorney.

Jim wrote: "David, I missed your comment about the Ace Special & "Green Eyes". Wow. Great minds, eh? Here's my review of Green Eyes, in case you're interested.
/review..."

My mileage definitely varied. Green Eyes put me on a Lucius Shepard kick that kept me going through three of his short story collections and his next four or five novels. It also got me reading The Serpent and the Rainbow by Wade Davis. If you're into finding out about real voodoo, this is an awesome book. I couldn't put it down.

I'm finding it interesting how many of us weren't all that jazzed about Neuromancer the first time around.

David wrote: "...I'm finding it interesting how many of us weren't all that jazzed about Neuromancer the first time around. "

It is surprising. I definitely loved it as did the few people I knew who read it. I was a carpenter back then. It wasn't until I switched careers to computers about 10 years later that I met many others who had read it.

I'm not into zombies or voodoo at all. I thought Shepard's take on it was very good & imaginative, though.

Reading this the second time round i'm still not really enjoying it. I don't think it's the writing, I think I just don't like the idea. I'll be honest here that i'm not very technically minded and so a lot of this just makes me switch off. I don't find any of the characters likeable either so that doesn't help.

I can imagine that it was ground-breaking, it has great review for example the review from the Times Literary Supplement on the back of my book describes it as 'The glamour of Samuel Delany and the vertigo of Philip K. Dick, and better organisation that either' - high praise indeed but just not the book for me.

Jo wrote: "Reading this the second time round i'm still not really enjoying it. I don't think it's the writing, I think I just don't like the idea. I'll be honest here that i'm not very technically minded and..."

That description makes it sound like it's for me. They are two of my favorite authors. I've also heard comparisons to Alfred Bester, another favorite. Maybe all of that comparison gave me too high an expectation of the book 25 years ago. Walking into it assuming I'm not going to like it may set me up better for a reading of it.

One of the more interesting things about the book is it was written on a typewriter, not a computer, which makes it more of an accomplishment of imagination than it might seem at first glance, if you don't know that.

I read through everyone's comments hoping to receive some inspiration to push on through this book, but no such luck! I am in awe at how slowly I'm reading this book. Perhaps it's too much of a 'new' culture or world for me, but it's taking all my discipline to turn the next page. A co-worker of mine mentioned it gets much easier in the last 20% but I'm still quite far off. Maybe once I jump all the way in the pool the chill will wear off.

...back to reading...

Michelle wrote: "I read through everyone's comments hoping to receive some inspiration to push on through this book, but no such luck! I am in awe at how slowly I'm reading this book. Perhaps it's too much of a '..."

I know what you mean. I have reached chapter 9 and have now stalled. I really don't think I will finish before the end of the month.

I seem to have a growing pile of in progress books. I started reading Stranger in a Strange Land by Robert Heinlein ages ago and when i'm reading it I enjoy it but I just never feel like picking it up to read!

I finally got around to starting Neuromancer a few days ago. It was immediately apparent what I didn't like about this book the first time around. Gibson uses common nouns to name a few of the main characters in the first chapter-- Case and Wage. They're common enough, if you're not reading closely, it's easy to read them in the sentence as a noun instead of a name and often they work in the sentence that way, but completely change the meaning. He also uses a clipped sentence structure. That coupled with unfamiliar Japanese place names and terminology make the first chapter nearly incomprehensible at times. I find myself having to reread paragraphs to follow the plot. I'm more familiar with Japanese culture now than I was the first time I read it, having read some Manga and gotten into some J-Pop for a while in the early 2000s. But back when I read it the first time, I remember glossing over whole paragraphs figuring I'd catch on to things as I went. That usually worked for me, but with this book I never quite connected. It left me unable to relate to the characters or care what was going on with them. It's a little better this time around, but it's taken me 3 days to read 16 pages and I'm not sure if I'll continue at this point as I keep needing to backtrack.

Jo wrote: "The glamour of Samuel Delany..."

I'm still trying to figure out what they could have meant by this. I really don't associate any of Delany's work with glamour.

Hi, I just started Neuromancer last night and came across this group thread. I also just finished Zero History, the final book in the Blue Ant series (which I read over the past several years. Airport bookstore finds.) I know I had my hands on Neuromancer when I was a teenager, but I don't remember reading it. I've read reviews of his Oct. 28th forthcoming release, which is supposed to hail back to his earlier material, so I'm starting back at the beginning so I can have context for the next one. Since this group is interested in the evolution of scifi, one could say I'm here because I'm interested in that in general and right now I'm curious about Gibson's own evolution.

I've managed to push my way through another chapter and the end of part 1. There are sequences that move along nicely and then there are other sequences after which I feel like I have no idea what happened. I came to the end of part 1 and tried to review the events and the one thing I'm clear on is Case was one mean cyber cowpoke, got injured and now he's been fixed by the elusive Mr. Armitage. There was another dude with a frustrating common noun name, Shin. Shortly before we see him, Case jumps out a window and hurts his shins. Argggh. This has to be intentional. I think Gibson wants us as off balance as Case while we're reading this. Frankly, I think events should be a lot more clear to me, if not what they mean, at least what happened. I think the clipped sentence structure is mostly what's getting in my way. This usually works for me with action sequences. A good example is the novels of Andrew Vacchs, but he's a mystery writer, so people here may not be familiar with him. Unfortunately, here it's just getting in my way and instead of speeding up the action sequence, it's slowing it down. I may just jump off and start Shadow Of The Torturer.

I'm curious to know how Gibson's other books compare to this one. I picked up Virtual Light recently and it's waiting to be read. I didn't like Neuromancer (for me too technical and unlikeable characters although clever idea) but I do wonder if it's typical of his books.

I pushed through to the end of Neuromancer last night. The dialogue comes across as 70s B-movie, and all of the characters are indeed deplorable. I honestly could not figure out why Case and Molly were even necessary or valuable toward the dubious end.

Having read the Blue Ant series over the past several years, those seem to flow in slow motion versus the hectic pacing of Neuromancer. I also just came across this, wherein Gibson talks about Gibson in what comes across as the Neuromancer narrator voice, Conversations with William Gibson:

The only kind of ghetto arrogance I can summon up from being a science fiction writer is, I can do fucking plot. I can feel my links to Dashiell Hammett. If I meet some guy who subsists on teaching writing in colleges, and if there's any kind of hostility, I think, I can do plot. I've still got wheels on my tractor. The great thing is when you're doing the other stuff and you whip the plot into gear, then you know you're driving something really weird.

I think that sums up why Neuromancer really fails for me as a story: computer plot, plot, plot, plot, plot in that hippie-druggy lingo.

Hmmm.. so Neuromancer is this famous SF novel, the progenitor of cyberpunk, and it seems like hardly anybody likes it.

Buck wrote: "Hmmm.. so Neuromancer is this famous SF novel, the progenitor of cyberpunk, and it seems like hardly anybody likes it."

weird, isn't it? I tried reading it again & couldn't take it, yet I loved it when it first came out. I guess it was that tied to the age in which it was written or perhaps my mental state at the time. (I used to drink a lot.) Could it be like a bar memory that I remember fondly & without much accuracy, then cringe when someone reminds me of what else went on?

I think it's more that Neuromancer was the first of its kind. As far as cyber punk goes, I like Effinger's When Gravity Fails a lot more. I read somewhere the two books were being written around the same time.

Jo wrote: "I'm curious to know how Gibson's other books compare to this one. I picked up Virtual Light recently and it's waiting to be read. I didn't like Neuromancer (for me too technical and u..."

I read the Blue Ant series spread out over 2008 to 2014. They aren't technical and have a very different, almost literary lite feel to them. Even minor characters are pretty fleshed out, and he also relies heavily on the present tense. I decided to move forward with The Peripheral, which was just released, since this will be a good time for me to compare his career progression before too much time passes and I forget.

I also skimmed his Wikipedia bio and that helped me understand the feel of Neuromancer better. It's a very well written sci-fi artifact at this point in history, even if it felt like I had to drag myself through it.

Salem wrote: "Jo wrote: "I'm curious to know how Gibson's other books compare to this one. I picked up Virtual Light recently and it's waiting to be read. I didn't like Neuromancer (for me too tech..."

I do feel I should read something else by William Gibson as it feels wrong to right him off based on one book. The Blue Ant series sounds much more to my liking and seems like it would be a good place to start.

Jo wrote: "I'm curious to know how Gibson's other books compare to this one"

Many of his subsequent books are quite similar in style and substance: Chapters about various characters who come together in the end, dark & gritty, slightly dystopian techno-heavy near-future etc.

IMHO, William Gibson started to slip with All Tomorrow's Parties (1999) and his Pattern Recognition (2003) has nowhere near the strength, coherence, and vision of his previous books. I read his next book Spook Country (2007) as well, and was similarly disappointed. His Zero History (2010) is Gibson's only book that I haven't read and probably never will.

He will soon publish another book called The Peripheral, which is apparently similar to his earlier books (say early reviews). I might give that a go.

He is great on Twitter, though.

I read The Neuromancer a couple years ago and I hardly remember it. It's the only William Gibson book I've read up til now. His The Peripheral is now on the New York times best seller list. I've got a hold on the audiobook at my library. I don't read a lot of new best sellers because the waiting line is so long, but for this one there are only four ahead of me. Has anybody read it?

Hi there, I'm writing from the BBC World Service Book club in London. We are interviewing William Gibson about Neuromancer and I wondered if any delightful Goodreaders might have a question about the book which they would like us to ask him? If anyone is interested please email me at [email protected] thanks! R

Buck wrote: "I read The Neuromancer a couple years ago and I hardly remember it. It's the only William Gibson book I've read up til now. His The Peripheral is now on the New York times best se..."

I read The Peripheral and did not care for it. It seems rather dumbed down, and I found an interview with him where he even mentions he self-edited to write to a broader audience, claiming only his closest of advisor/friends, what have you, would get his futuristic fictive technology otherwise.

I even started highlighting all of the typos and redundancies, I got so bored with the slapdash editing. BUT plenty of readers love it. It's a populist score, even if it flunks for me as a story.

That must be what he had been doing since All Tomorrow's Parties - purposefully dumbing down his books. Why, though? He was already the most famous author in his sub-genre, so his books were obviously being read and understood by significantly more people than just his agent and close friends.

Or, maybe he is one of those authors who just lose their edge and start publishing mediocre books after a while.

Salem wrote: "I read The Peripheral and did not care for it. It seems rather dumbed down, and I found an interview with him where he even mentions he self-edited to write to a broader audience, claiming only his closest of advisor/friends, what have you, would get his futuristic fictive technology otherwise.

I even started highlighting all of the typos and redundancies, I got so bored with the slapdash editing. "

Oh, no. As soon as I saw it on the bestseller list I put a hold on the library audiobook. There are only 3 in line ahead of me. I see that it's not on this week's bestseller list.

I abhor 'slapdash editing' as you put it, Salem. It ruins a book for me. I guess the audiobook reader can hide the typos, but poor word usage would still stand out. If that's the case, I'll release my hold on it rather than suffer through 14 hours of poorly written audio.

Has anyone else read it?

A friend of mine just did a good review of "The Peripheral" here:
/review/show...

Zeynep wrote: "That must be what he had been doing since All Tomorrow's Parties - purposefully dumbing down his books. Why, though? He was already the most famous author in his sub-genre, so his books were obviou..."

Here's the article:

Buck wrote: "Salem wrote: "I read The Peripheral and did not care for it. It seems rather dumbed down, and I found an interview with him where he even mentions he self-edited to write to a broader audience, cla..."

You should give it a shot. The typos won't come up in the audio. Most of them are actually a significant character's name spelled with a deleted consonant here and there.

I don't know who the audio version narrator is, but if they do accents that could make it interesting. It just didn't work for me. I liked Neuromancer much better.

I'm listening to From Here To Infinity: An Exploration of Science Fiction Literature, one of The Great Courses, & Drout says that Gibson got his style from Jayne Anne Phillips' Black Tickets: Stories. I've never heard of her work. Anyone else?

Not me, either. Huh. Chronology works (Black tickets pub date 1979, Johnny Mnemonic (1981), Johnny Mnemonic (1981)

Huh-2. Hippie Hat Brain Parasite (1983) ! WTF?


Love the art! Pretty sure I've read it. Collected in Semiotext[e] SF (89),
Or not. Many, many short-shorts:
�� Frankenstein Penis �� short story by Ernest Hogan
�� Jane Fonda's Augmentation Mammoplasty �� short story by J. G. Ballard -- there's a theme here....
�� Saint Francis Kisses His Ass Goodbye �� novelette by Philip José Farmer
�� I Was a Teenage Genetic Engineer �� short story by Denise Angela Shaw
Etc, etc.
Absolutely none of these ring a bell. FWTW. Now that I think on it, this anthol got decidedly mixed receptions.... 🚀 ⚡️ 🤯 🤓

Peter wrote: "...Semiotext[e] SF..."

"Semiotext[e] SF" turned me on to many cool writers when I read it back in the 1990s. Probably not the best work of any of those writers, so no need to seek it out.