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I'm about three quarters through this book and though I'm beginning to enjoy it I'm unsure if we can call it a YA book. The violence is too graphic for the audience intended and although it does fit with the subject matter I wonder if this should have been in a different award.

I have finished this book. It was very good although I still feel that the violence is maybe too much for a YA considering that some 12+ would be reading it. What do you think?

I've decided to read them roughly in age order this year so I'm leaving In Darkness and Verity till last as I think it will negatively affect my reading of the younger novels. Having said that, older teenagers are rarely disturbed by the same thing as adults!

I'm reading this at the moment and I found it really dull at first but I'm getting into it now.
I don't feel the violence is ridiculously graphic, its definately a constant but it serves a purpose and fits with the book so I don't think it's so obvious.

Hi Abigail how are you getting on with In Darkness?

What a good idea! Think I might try that as well.

Where did you get the bookmarks or did you make them?

Ok Thanks Anne sound like a good idea. Might have to be wary of handing out the painting of Midwinterblood. Quite clearly a male nude in there! I'd anticipate some complaints from yr 7 parents!

I think I might be making bookmarks today :) I have an adult book group who I persuaded to read the shortlist and we talked about In Darkness last night. It's really interesting to hear adults talk about these books as the perspective is so different. One interesting comment was that because it was written from the perspective of a 12 yr old boy who has always lived in terrible conditions it was written with a very matter of fact voice. So possibly the emotion of the situation was lost or meant to be lost. They loved the fact that a lot of research had gone into the book but were not sure if anyone under 15 should be reading it......

Only just started this, it's creepy but I love the - is it Haitian French? scattered through the pages. Trying to convince myself reading it is as good as revision for my mock French oral!

Ha Ha! My daughter convinced herself that watching A Town Called Panic was a good way to revise for her French exams! Not sure if 'bricomarque' or 'Cheval!' came up!

Just started reading this, decided to leave Verity till last. Pretty dark and bleak so far! Really not for yr 7.
@zara also not convinced this can be helping your French ;)

Yeah, unfortunately un vre chimere didn't come up when I was discussing what did last weekend (or fortunately, whichever way you look at it...). Finished the book today, it's fairly grim! I thought links between the two stories were slightly tenuous (don't want to spoil the plot here!) but I'd never heard about how violent the gang lands are in Haiti. I thought it was great how the story combined with the earthquake, something everyone thinks they know so much about after it was on the news. I'll write a proper review of it soon.

I too did not know much about Haiti and liked the fact that I learnt something that I did not know before. I was shocked by the violence and the way it was talked about so matter of factly. In a way that was why it was so shocking......life is like that for them everyday so that's how it is. I loved the two stories running side by side and how they merged at the end was very clever. I won't say anymore incase someone hasn't finished it. I don't think you would have learnt much that was useful for your French oral though.....nice try though :)

What's Nick Lake's background? Is it just well researched or has he lived there?

Not sure but it was well researched. Will have a look at the Carnegie site and see if it says anything.

It seems from what I have just read is that it is researched but he had stretched the truth with some of the historical facts. The current story though is close to the truth. He has never lived in Haiti as far as I can tell.

Still ploughing through this. It's well written but I can't honestly say I'm enjoying it. It reminds me of Out of Shadows a couple of years back which I hated reading. Zara your description of the novel 'grim' pretty much sums it up so far and I'm only on page 90 or so.

I have to say, nothing I have read so far suggests that it is a YA novel. I would be really alarmed about some of my yr 7 reading group reading it. Luckily the less mature ones seems to be self censoring so far. I'm just waiting for the first parental complaint!

Finished: phew! The second half was more engaging and somehow less violent though I suspect the death count was much higher.

This is my last book to go - would like to get it finished by Tuesday as we are holding a Carnegie Conference in West Berkshire for our pupils, but don't think I will by the sounds of it! If any of you want to know more about children in Haiti look up a guy called Jean-Robert Cadet. I was lucky enough to hear him talk at a local school about child slavery still existing in Haiti and his work to abolish it - appalling that this exists today - they can call it any name they like but it is still slavery!

Btw Anna, I loved Out of Shadows. It will remain one of my memorable reads for a long time and sends shivers down my spine when I think of it. My year 9s at the time agreed and have spread the word - it is still being read regularly.

I have found this book has created great discussions in my groups and those yr 7's who have read it do not seem to be as upset by the violence in it as I would expect them to be. I should also say that those yr7's are in a group that I am helping with so I have no say as to what they should be allowed to read. I have not let any yr7's borrow it in other groups but if they have chosen to go to the public library and borrow it then so be it.

I think the reason they don't find it upsetting is that it is written from a 12 yr Old boys perspective which is very matter of fact. I was horrified by the babies in the bin but the fact that I am a mother and have more life experience than the children reading it maybe gives them a different reading experience.

I enjoyed reading Out of Shadows but there is a trend in this short list for very gritty sad books. I would like to see some older and more cheerful books on this short list.

Karen wrote: "Btw Anna, I loved Out of Shadows. It will remain one of my memorable reads for a long time and sends shivers down my spine when I think of it. My year 9s at the time agreed and have spread the word..."

I found it so hard to read. My son was the same age as the main character. I just wanted to scream at the parents 'Get him out of there!'

I think children 'see' differently when they read books. Our life experience means we are more horrified by the implications of actions. Children and teenagers don't always see as big a picture as they are likely to ground it in their experience. For example I really struggled with Siobhan Dowd's 'Bog Child' having spent my teenage years watching news stories about Northern Ireland, and turned each page with dread, expecting a knee capping at the very least. The students just read the story.

That can cause problems with film versions of a book as it projects an adult's reading of a book on the viewer.

I suppose in fantasy like Maggot Moon we are on more of an even platform as its harder to predict where the author will take you and I find it easier to distance myself.

Elizabeth - I agree with the life experience comment - Marcus Segdwick White Crow freaked me out as a mother, my students don't find it that scary.

Do you all find it difficult to find cheery YA fiction? I do, I want to cry before reading dystopian! Does this reflect the angst of teenagers or perhaps something more light and cheery may have an effort on them?

I like interesting YA.
Teenagers are different. Many, including A level students don't mind shocking but hate
anything depressing. Often the stronger readers enjoy looking for books that present things outside of their own experiences and I think there is a fascination for extreme situations...what if ... Type scenarios, hence the interest in Hunger Games. Older teens are going through a range of new experiences and often are keen to explore them- even if they will never experience them. Younger students often avoid challenging or threatening story lines.

My daughter now 16 was very very wary of anything scary till she was nearly 15. Now she'll read GRR Martin and Laurell Hamilton alongside Scott Fitzgerald and Virginia Woolf, (as well as YA).

@Karen White Cat by Holly Black is worth a look. It's paranormal but it quite an interesting mystery in a fairly dark society.

I agree with you Anna on your comment about Bog Child and background knowledge of Northern Ireland. I wasn't sure that the teenagers would get the story without knowing about the issues in Northern Ireland but even though the majority knew non of the troubles it didn't seem to effect their enjoyment of the story.

I definitely think that the film version of a YA book takes on a very different feel and it must have something to do with it being taken from an adult perspective. Also it's interesting to hear what we think YA want to read, I agree they tend to like gritty novels. It would be nice to see more funny books written for YA but they tend to be for the younger market which is a shame.

I think that was what Roddy Doyle tried to do, but for me it really didn't work. I can't think of any funny YA books for older teens.
Oh apart from Skulduggery Pleasant and HPotter, but both have a dark side and started off with an 11 yr old market.

I found this had a really slow start but I thought it developed into something really good. I hadn't realised how much history Haiti had, as soon as I finished the book I started reading up about Haitian history. I have never done this before with a book.

(Weighing in on the dystopian/teen reading discussion)

I agree with what Anna was saying I think there is a fascination for extreme situations
I'm 16 and I find reading something that is so different from my experiences really engaging. I 'shock' value of novel is generally a selling point as well, either because it makes the book original or engaging.

However I do find I've got sick of dystopian. After the success of The Hunger Games I feel the standard of new dystopian novels being released has fallen. So many of them are poorly written and are just fighting to have a more controversial storyline than The Hunger Games (which most of them fail to do.) A dystopian that is poorly written and not shocking fails to be engaging, so I've mainly given up on them.

How did you feel about Maggot Moon? I agree with what you say about many YA dystopians but that's partly because they get distracted by a romance. I have to say really liked Cinder as it worked so differently.

Maggot Moon was harsh but original, which I found really great. Also it didn't have a predictable HEA unlike most YA (dystopians)
I liked Cinder too, but I wouldn't say it was a dystopian.

I was probably stretching that a bit ;)