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BYT 2014 Reading Challenge: World War 1 Centenary


2014 will mark 100 years since the start of the First World War. Here at BYT we plan to mark the war and its consequences by reading 12 books that should give anyone who reads them a better understanding of the First World War.

The First World War was a turning point in world history. It claimed the lives of over 16 million people across the globe and had a huge impact on those who experienced it. The war and its consequences shaped much of the twentieth century, and the impact of it can still be felt today.

The BYT 2014 Reading Challenge will be our way of helping to remember those who lived, fought and served during the years 1914-18.

There's a thread for each of the 12 books.

Welcome to the thread for...



The Great Silence by Juliet Nicolson
(Category: Armistice and Aftermath)

You can read the books in any order. Whilst you're reading them, or after you've finished, come and share your thoughts and feelings, ask questions, and generally get involved. The more we all participate, the richer and more fulfilling the discussions will be for us all. Here's to a stimulating, informative, and enjoyable BYT 2014 Reading Challenge.

I have just started this book.


Juliet Nicolson is, apparently, the Vita Sackville-West's granddaughter who herself was married to the diplomat Harold Nicolson.

So far, and I've only read the introduction and the opening chapter, it's all pretty familiar stuff. I think that's because I'm starting to amass quite a knowledge about the conflict from the various books I have read, along with watching documentaries and other articles.

I am looking forward to finding out more about the two years immediately after the end of World War 1 which, as we already know, was a period of enormous social change.

I have now finished The Great Silence by Juliet Nicolson


I had high hopes for this book, and was looking forward to finding out more about the two years immediately after the end of World War 1 which presaged a period of enormous social change. The book takes a chronological approach, and gives almost every chapter a one word title (e.g. Wound, Hopelessness, Yearning, Resignation etc.).

For every interesting piece of information (e.g. the tragedy of the Scottish soldiers returning to the Isle of Lewis, the Spanish flu epidemic, or the development of reconstructive surgery), there seemed to be coverage of less relevant issues (Lady Diana Cooper's addiction to cocaine and morphine, Lady Ottoline Morrell having an affair with a younger stonemason, Tom Mitford's dietary choices, or the King's uncertainty about a two minute silence).

I wonder if the immediate two year period following the war was an insufficient timeframe to understand the social impact of WW1. Certainly I found The Long Week-end: A Social History of Great Britain, 1918-39 by Robert Graves, and The Age of Illusion: England in the Twenties and Thirties, 1919-1940 by Ronald Blythe, which cover the longer period between World War One and World War Two, to be far more interesting and satisfying to read.

Overall I thought there was far too much emphasis on the aristocracy and, whilst a quick and easy read, ultimately it felt superficial, incoherent and a missed opportunity. It frequently read more like an upper class gossip column than a serious social history. Very disappointing.

2/5

Some readers have rated it five stars - and it does contain some interesting info so definitely worth reading. Hopefully now I have managed your expectations Val you might be pleasantly surprised.

There were a lot of interesting things in this book, but I felt it was poorly written. For me, there were too many little anecdotes about people or events that weren't tied in with anything else. However, parts of it were fascinating. I especially valued the parts about Harold Gillies and his pioneering plastic surgery work. I've read a little about the "gueules cassees" as the French call the soldiers whose faces were so horribly damaged, but I didn't know much about the reconstructive work that was done on them. I was also very interested in the account of the idea for the 2 minute silence and the history of the Cenotaph.

^ That sums up my feelings too. I thought the part about plastic surgery was wonderful.

However, as much as I am interested by the Mitfords, I was amazed when Juliet Nicholson chose to include a section about Tom's dietary requirements or how he subtly commiserated with his mother at the birth of another girl. Her preoccupation with aristocratic goings on generally felt tangential at best, and irrelevant at worst.

I thought I posted this yesterday, but must have navigated away before hitting post. I have a question-

to what degree is the 2 minute silence still observed? Is it still seen as relevant?

I wonder because as an American, I know that many, perhaps most, people look at our Veterans' Day simply as an excuse for a day off work. There are some public observances but overall it is not that significant a day here. Wondering if Remembrance Day and the silence are taken more seriously in Britain...
Thanks.

Remembrance Day church services take place on the nearest Sunday. So far as I know the silence is generally well observed in Britain. There's usually a memorial service on TV with a ceremony at the Cenotaph in London. That said the significance is diminishing over time. I should add this a very subjective and personal view and I don't claim any great knowledge.

Thanks, Nigeyb. I realize this is your personal view, but you're there and know a lot more about it than I do! Does the whole country grind to a halt as was described in the book?

Thanks Barbara. No, the whole country does not grind to a halt however plenty of people do still observe it. Here's an article about Remembrance Day in 2011...



And, as I say above, the second Sunday of November, is known as Remembrance Sunday, when a two minute silence is observed at 11am at war memorials, cenotaphs, religious services etc. throughout the country.

Some places in Britain observe on Armistice Day, at 11am, on the 11th November too besides Remembrance Sunday. I worked for many years in a library. It was observed sometimes there.

^ That's right. Two different days - Remembrance Sunday ( the second Sunday of November) @ 11 am - and the day of the Armistice, known as Remembrance Day, 11 Nov @ 11 am.

I have worked in places where there was a silence on 11 Nov @ 11 am - it's far from universal though. I think BBC Radio 4 and Radio 3 observe it - I doubt the other stations do though.

You're an ex-librarian Roisin? I've always fancied being a librarian - though suspect the reality is rather dull. I get a strange frisson just thinking about working in a library and always enjoy my visits. I wonder how many others experience something similar?

Another confirmation:
It is not universal, but a lot of people observe the two minutes silence on 11th November and everywhere I have worked have encouraged employees to do so (apart from one company, who did not mention it, but did not penalise anyone who did stop work). There are also church services and commemorations at cenotaphs and war memorials on Remembrance Sunday, as Nigey and Roisin have said. My parents told me that when they were children all traffic stopped, including buses, trains, trams, etc. and everyone stopped work.

Thanks, all, for clarifying. The Daily Mail article was very interesting, as were all your comments.

Barbara, where I live in the US, Veterans' Day is taken very seriously.

You are right that Veterans' Day is taken seriously but not generally as a remembrance or reminder of the First World War dead, but for veterans of all wars. The same is true of Memorial Day which began as a remembrance of the Civil War dead, and specifically the Union dead.

Ours are for all war dead and wounded too, although the commemoration and the idea of using a poppy as a symbol started just after the First World War.

Once a Librarian, always a Librarian. : ) I'm a qualified one! Left employment last year. Might go back part-time, but aim to do voluntary work first. However, Librarians are not valued in this country or are libraries sadly...

Yes Armistice day is not always observed.

Roisin wrote: "Once a Librarian, always a Librarian. : )"


Hurrah!

Let's talk Dewey Decimal.

PS: I value both libraries and librarians.

I was a librarian and I am still passionate about libraries. My son used to love coming to work with me and stamping the books :)

Thanks Susan - yet more fuel to my argument and belief that librarians are inherently wonderful people. One of my sisters used to work in a local library on a Saturday whilst she was at school.


Here's a trip down memory lane for all you librarians and library users.


It's one of the old library cards that used to get stamped when a library users took a book out. This one also happens to be for one of my favourite writers... Night and the City by Gerald Kersh....

I heard on a radio show that the reason more women read/buy books than men is linked to the fact that it was always the women's responsibility to choose the family reading material from the library. Certainly from Austen' s kind of era, she mentions it often in letters.

I was a library school dropout a long time ago.

I have just collected this book from my local library. I have read two pages of the introduction so far and the author has already managed to annoy me, so I am very glad I could borrow it from the library as at least I only paid a £0.50 reservation fee to be annoyed.

^ Annoyance within two pages. Is this a new record Val?

Nigeyb wrote: "^ Annoyance within two pages. Is this a new record Val?"
I think it is Nigey.
I should suppress the rant until I have read a bit more of the book, but it was not a promising start.

Luckily you had a local library!

As for Susan's interesting comment about women and books women buy/read mainly fiction (according to BBC radio 4), which sells the most and are there propping up the market.

I'm a bit late to the conversation but wanted to add something on whether the country comes to a halt for the 2 minute silence...I work for the civil service and I can wholeheartedly say that yes the entire British Civil Service comes to a halt at 11am on 11th Nov every year...it's a big thing. There are war memorials in every town and village up and down the country and these are always festooned with poppy wreaths and our local park in Gateshead started a new tradition a few years ago of creating a memorial garden 0 basically a flower bed that is cleared so that wooden crosses with poppies are 'planted' one for every local soldier lost in war...not just the first and second world war either, also those lost in more modern conflicts like Iraq and Afghanistan. - My experience has been that Remembrance continues to be taken very seriously where I am here in the North of England.

Val wrote: "I should suppress the rant until I have read a bit more of the book, but it was not a promising start."

Rant: /review/show...

There were some parts of the book which did not annoy me, but not enough. The only new information I got from this book was information I did not want to know, did not care about and found completely irrelevant.

Ally wrote: "I'm a bit late to the conversation but wanted to add something on whether the country comes to a halt for the 2 minute silence...I work for the civil service and I can wholeheartedly say that yes t..."


Very interesting Ally, thank you for sharing this.

A patchy and ultimately unsatisfying read. While there were some interesting facts and poignant moments, the whole was much less than the sum of those parts. That aside, reading this during the Anzac day commemorations was quite interesting, giving me an insight into the creation of rituals like the cenotaph and the minutes silence, which always seemed like the 'normal' way to mark these moments. So, while it isn't the most interesting or engaging of the books i have read in this challenge, it did open up some new ways of seeing things.

I only started this book today, and am already two thirds of the way through - I'm a bit surprised to see that others haven't liked it, since I think it is an excellent, powerful read and probably going to end up as a five-star book for me.

Juliet Nicolson has a great style of writing, and, although I can see there is a lot of focus on the aristocracy and richer people, I like the way she constantly draws contrasts between these people and the poorer society around them. Also must agree that the whole section about Gillies and his pioneering plastic surgery is fascinating.

I read this one quite some time ago but I do remember certain parts...the building and design of the Cenotaph is fascinating as is the origins of the 2 minute silence and the author 's writing style is engaging but I confess that I too found the perspective skewed towards the upper classes which jarred ever so slightly.

Thanks, Ally, I definitely agree that the Cenotaph and the 2-minute silence are fascinating too.

I wonder if it's mainly that more material is probably available about the individual lives of the rich and famous and that may be a reason for the book's focus?

Well-known people also dominated in the similarly-constructed Bill Bryson book we read here recently, One Summer: America, 1927, which I also really liked - anecdotal and personal history tends to stay with me better.

Yes that's very likely. Possibly the lives of the upper classes are a lot more commercial too. I think that the war was a great leveller and the story of the unknown soldier embodies this 'Everyman' status. It's nice to read about the upper classes but it's a shame we don't have more stories about the ordinary folk.

If you look for them, there are a lot of diaries, letters of more average soldiers out there being published especially on Kindle. Possibly people are just digging out attics to see if they can make a buck off of grandpa. But I've been seeing an awful lot of that sort of thing.

I'm still reading this ... off and on.

I almost started this yesterday but thought I'd go for some fiction instead... And then started some Nellie Bly. Ah well. Soon though. I've been bad on this challenge...

So have I! But I am determined to get Ashenden, Testament of a Youth, and Goodbye To All That read before the year is out. Definitely!

I have the Hemingway, Testament of Youth, this one and I think one other, plus a number that we didn't pick. /hijack

I started this one yesterday and I'm just over half way through. I agree that there are some really interesting sections, but on the whole it seems really disjointed, with random snippets of information about the post war years and it kind of jumps around a lot. Although I like the details about Diana Manners/Copper it feels like she's getting a disproportionate amount of line space, perhaps because she had better written records and letters for Juliet Nicolson to work from.

Just to say I've noticed that the book's chapter headings follow the stages of grief after a bereavement, from the initial 'Shock' and 'Denial' through to 'Acceptance'. But there are various other stages added to the five or seven you usually see described.

Finished this today. My thoughts didn't really change from what I wrote above. Agree with the general consensus that it contained some interesting facts, but was skewed towards the upper classes and very erratic in topics covered.

I believe I am in the minority as far as my opinion of this book. But then, I am a sentimentalist so it struck at my heart. The British Empire lost 1.18 million dead.....an entire generation of young men of all classes. Granted, the author concentrated on the upper classes but her family is a member of that class, so that may be the reason. She may not be the greatest writer but the book resonated with me and the frontispiece picture, "Grief" by Hugh Cecil, said it all.

The upper classes are the ones more likely to have kept journals, written memoirs, and, definitely more likely to have gotten them published - they had the contacts. Middle class may have also kept journals but these would be the ones found in attics today. These are the two classes more likely to be better educated, and, thus, more thoughtful and needing to write things down.

When the Americans got in, they were urged to write home on a regular basis. And the American Red Cross set up writing rooms to give them a place to do so. The same may have been true for the British.

So these people - letter writers, journal keepers, memoirists - would be the sources for Nicholson.

Jan C wrote: "The upper classes are the ones more likely to have kept journals, written memoirs, and, definitely more likely to have gotten them published - they had the contacts. Middle class may have also kept journals but these would be the ones found in attics today. "

That's not accurate in this instance Jan. Victorian and Edwardian educational reforms had resulted in widespread literacy and the army which Britain sent out was the most widely and deeply educated in her history.

There was a recent TV series here in the UK on ITV that I mentioned on the other information thread called "The Great War: The People's Story" which demonstrated that plenty of ordinary soldiers and their relatives back at home were writing letters and poetry, and keeping journals, as did another recent BBC series called "Our World War".

Both programmes drew extensively on the letters and journals of ordinary people. There are also many books which collect these information sources.

Jan C wrote: "So these people - letter writers, journal keepers, memoirists - would be the sources for Nicholson."

It's been a while since I read this book, but given that it was dealing with the two years after the war, I am not sure to what extent she was using letters and journals for her research. A lot of what she highlighted would have been in newspapers.

Anyway in any event, I think her emphasis on the aristocracy was just personal preference, which is fine, it just made for a missed opportunity in terms of rigorously chronicling and analysing the enormous social change that took place in the two years following the war.