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This is the discussion thread for the March 2018 Group Read of The Ill-Made Knight by Christian Cameron

All welcome in discussion, even if you are only thinking about reading it, or, have already read it.

I have already read this one so will join in the conversation as an 'already read' visitor.

This was my review of The Ill-Made Knight. /review/show...

I had said in my review that the book was badly edited and was full of typos, but I got a first copy, I assume later copies had those issues all fixed.

I enjoyed it a lot and have only just recently read book two in this Chivalry series;

Seeing as I have read this, I'll join in any convo, but I'll be reading the book that lost in the Poll to the Ill-Made Knight, Hawkwood.

I'm going to post my thoughts on that in the Men of Iron (Knights) thread if anybody else is reading that one too.
/topic/show/...

I read this not to long ago and I really like it. Mr Cameron had a gift for fight sequences and "Knightly" thought processes.

I'll probably read #2 in the series since it is on my nook right now.

This is my first time doing the group read a long. Going to start the book this evening.

I love this book. I'm actually rereading it right now, which I hardly ever do. Then I'll reread The Long Sword. I've already purchased The Green Count. Such a spree!
I actually got to him a little while back, for those who want more Cameron.

I am hopefully getting The Long Sword from my library soon, so I will read that in this books place as my library can't seem to get Hawkwood

Helen wrote: "This is my first time doing the group read a long. Going to start the book this evening."

Welcome to your first group read Helen. :)
Hope you like the book!

Justin wrote: "I love this book. I'm actually rereading it right now, which I hardly ever do. Then I'll reread The Long Sword. I've already purchased The Green Count. Such a spree!
I actually got to interview hi..."

I'm holding out for the paperback release of The Green Count. Hardcover out of my budget. :)

I am really looking forward to reading The Green Count.

Feel free peoples, to add your thoughts on The Long Sword too, but just keep them spoilered, or make the comments clean of any facts that may spoil storylines from Book one.

Four posts in a row..watch me go!


For those new to this series, these are the books in the series.

and this next one is not released as of the date of this post

Terri wrote: "Feel free peoples, to add your thoughts on The Long Sword too, but just keep them spoilered, or make the comments clean of any facts that may spoil storylines from Book one."

Ack :)

Terri wrote: "Justin wrote: "I love this book. I'm actually rereading it right now, which I hardly ever do. Then I'll reread The Long Sword. I've already purchased The Green Count. Such a spree!
I actually got ..."
I got the Kindle book for my birthday. Happy day!

I would actually love to reread The Ill-Made Knight. :( But I am so behind on my reading I just can't do it. I also want to reread the entire Robert Low Oathsworn series. When will I ever get the chance!?

Terri wrote: "I would actually love to reread The Ill-Made Knight. :( But I am so behind on my reading I just can't do it. I also want to reread the entire Robert Low Oathsworn series. When will ..."

Oh how I'd love to reread Robert Low...

Robert wrote: "Long live William Gold."

I second that!

Reading Hawkwood by Jack Ludlow now. For those that do not know, this is set in the same time frame and around the same people, with hawkwood appearing in Ill-Made Knight.

Gold is mentioned in Hawkwood as Christopher Gold, not William.

Its quite dry and doesn't pack a lot of punch, but so far I am not put off by that.

@Helen (and all :-) my first time too

And it was a good one.

This time frame and topic is very different for me, but is generally why I thought this group might be interesting.

I really liked this. I agree about the fight scenes and thought processes of knights. William Gold really informed my understanding of 'chivalry'. I also really enjoyed the contrast he presented between Emile and Milady. So interesting.

I was completely absorbed which I find kind of odd considering it was a big monologue. But I was and I will definitely be seeking out the next one.

Glad you enjoyed your first one, Peaktopeak. Hopefully you'll jump into another. :)

Next one is Cathar if anybody is interested. I'll be reading this one.

Terri wrote: "Glad you enjoyed your first one, Peaktopeak. Hopefully you'll jump into another. :)

Next one is Cathar if anybody is interested. I'll be reading this one."

That looks good Terri - on to the ever expanding TBR is goes :)

I'm going to have to post pone my read for this month. I've had 4 ILLs come in for me and they all have to read by next month. 2 are from Ben Kane's newish series Eagle of Rome (the third one was requested, but hasn't come in yet)

/series/1333...

and the other 2 are David M. Glantz's NF books on WWII in Russia

I hate when all the IILs you requested come in at the same time:)

I hate that too! You are going to be super busy, mate.

My library system only allows 3 ILLs per fortnight.

I rated this close to 4.5*. I really liked the gritty realities of the knight/mercenary life, and the unapologetic depiction of the war. These are not often good people. Although it could be frustrating, I ultimately liked how incompetent William could be without realizing it. Each time he took on a foe and got hammered when (for dramatic reasons) I might have expected him to win or at least get a hit in, I appreciated the author's choice to show realism for his untrained "knight." I also liked how the many sides kept changing with their conflicting loyalties, though it could be confusing to follow (as it must have been in reality).

The main issue holding me back from a higher rating is that I had trouble following some of the side characters. William referred to people by names and titles but wasn't consistent, so I sometimes couldn't remember if/how he had met someone before, or why he hated/liked them. I also could have used more maps and an expanded glossary.

Still, overall the book was excellent and I'm sure I will read others in the series and by the author. He's been on my list for awhile and I'm glad I finally read one of his books!

Margaret wrote: "My library system only allows 3 ILLs per fortnight."

The Western Australia library system now only allows 12 ILLs per year!!! So I now need a spare wallet to carry my library card collection... Grrr

I loved this book and am just starting The Long Sword. Hawkwood has been mentioned again, making me curious about Hawkwood. I love all the chivalry...

I also love Christian Cameron even more after reading The Red Knight.

I haven't read fantasy for well over a decade, but I'm going to give that Red Knight a go.

Haven't had much opportunity to read lately so still not finished Ludlow's Hawkwood.
'Christopher' Gold is described by Hawkwood in the book as having acne but still a goodlooking youth despite it. :-) Not like how 'William' Gold would describe himself in the Christian Cameron Chivalry series I'm sure.

Terri wrote: "I haven't read fantasy for well over a decade, but I'm going to give that Red Knight a go.

Haven't had much opportunity to read lately so still not finished Ludlow's Hawkwood.
'Christopher' Gold ..."

Haha! Yeah I don't see him with acne...

And a cracking voice. :) Hawkwood is thinking it is time young Gold had his first woman.

It is funny seeing the differences between Ludlow's Gold and Cameron's. Both enjoyable to read about.

Just finished my second read of The Ill-made Knight. Loved it even more the second time. I'm on to The Long Sword. Cameron does such a good job of dropping you into 14th-century Europe, into the headspace of a man-at-arms.

Haven't read this yet, but the whole Long War Series is Awesome.

David wrote: "Haven't read this yet, but the whole Long War Series is Awesome."
I've got my hands on the first two books of that series. Looking forward to starting it soon.

Long War didn't grab me off the first book, but I am going to give it another go now that I have read two in his Chivalry series.
I didn't gel with the narrative style in books one of Long Wars. I think maybe I am more adapted to his writing style now.

It's just a touch late for the March theme read, but I started Mr. Cameron's



yesterday.

I had a bunch of ILLs (Ben Kane's Eagles of Rome Trilogy and a couple of David Glantz' WW II histories) come in and they HAD to be read first

/series/1333...

also posted in the "What are you reading now" thread

For some reason I had forgotten you'd postponed, and that you were done and on to The Green Count, happy.

I haven't been paying attention in class. :]

Well, you have had other, more important, things on your mind.

This is true. I am definitely cruising under half sail right now. lol.
I won't have too much cleverness about me for a while. :D

I'm plowing along on The Long Sword - about 1/2 done.

Our hero has been a mercenary in Italy and knighted. He is now bound for a crusade (5th?). Cameron has a really good scene of the Melee part of a joust as Gold fights with the Cypriot King against the HRE and his entourage.

I really like this passage from the Joust scene

I put my spurs to Jacques (his horse) � he didn’t deserve that, but I was hurt and in a hurry, and Jacques exploded in outraged innocence, put his head down and crashed into one of the Swabians with a sound like an army of tinkers doing battle with an army of wooden spoons

"a sound like an army of tinkers doing battle with an army of wooden spoons".

I LOVE it! :D

He's great. Lol. One of the top hist fic writers hands down.
He can waffle, but it's forgivable.

I started this one several weeks ago, then put aside to finish some others. Picking it back up, & I'm enjoying it--but, why no chapters? Usually when I'm reading (especially when I'm starting a book), I like to set myself a goal of reading a chapter or two or three, depending on their length, but when you can't find the end of ? for almost 100 pages, I tend to set aside & read something else. Ok--maybe it's just me? (I have to admit, as a writer, I do tend to have long chapters on my first & second drafts, but I know I need to break them up better before I finish).

I hear you, Patricia. It is a gripe of ,mine too. I don't think some writers realise chapter breaks are important to readers. If it isn't some uniquely voiced literary piece that breaks all rules, then I think the novel should always have chapters.

I had forgotten about it in Ill Made Knight. So when I read book two, The Long Sword, and came across his chapter thing again, I was a bit disappointed.

I don't know why some authors do it, but in lieu of long or no chapters, I like it when there are breaks in the text. Those can be good pausing places. Ruth Downie's books are examples of chapters the ideal length, in my opinion.

Glad I'm not the only one. He does have breaks in the text, but I would still prefer some chapter breaks.

I finally finished The Long Sword

I thought it was a good read, but I didn't like it quite as much as the first one. This novel has Sir WIlliam is in Italy fighting with Hawkwood. He then joins the Hospitallers as a volunteer to go on Crusade. Much of the middle of the novel is taken up with the preparation and the politics of that. The last section of the novel is the Crusaders capturing and then withdrawing from Alexandria.

Mr. Cameron's battle sequences alone make it worth the read. Solid 4 stars.

I'll definitely read #3 in the series. I purchased it this evening and it is on the nook wait for me:)

Some of those sections you mentioned, got a little long winded in The Long Sword I feel, happy. A bit of editing wouldn't have gone astray I believe.

Chapters are a necessity if the author is not doing some elaborate literary creation.
For genre fiction, we need places to have a break. So that when we pick it up, we feel ebbs and flows of the book better.
No chapters, and it leaves you forgetting where everything was happening, and where you even at.

Terri wrote: "Some of those sections you mentioned, got a little long winded in The Long Sword I feel, happy. A bit of editing wouldn't have gone astray I believe."

That middle section is what dropped it a star for me. That and the lack of chapters that you mentioned.