ŷ������

This thread is the spoiler thread. This book is about Maya's childhood, so feel free to express your reactions to the events she writes about.

This book is one of the most banned or challenged books currently being read in high school. Do you think it is appropriate for teenagers to read? Why do you think it has been challenged?

Hi Emily & thanks for setting these threads up.

I came so close to being able to read this book completely unspoiled (remember I am in New Zealand) Unfortunately I glanced at the blurb just before starting.

I think it is very appropriate for teenagers to read. If I was the parent I would want to be in on the discussions though if the teen was 12 (some kids in NZ start high school at 12) to 15. Edit: I don't mean I would want to be in the classroom, but I would want to talk it over at home with my kids.

I don't think it protects our girls not knowing the dangers in their world.

I can't find that this book has ever been challenged or banned in New Zealand. Banning is relatively rare here and it is normally for stuff that would curl your toes. I did see the NZ lists at the time of removing from view of Into the River by Ted Dawe from sale & our libraries- I really don't want to look again.

So I could give my assumptions about why it has been banned in other countries but I don't actually know.

I have lots of thoughts but I'll wait a bit longer before expressing them.

I'll add the really shocking points for me.

The first (obviously) is the (view spoiler)[ rape of Marguerite by Freeman, but also how clever he was with the grooming & silencing her - in the end quite literally. (hide spoiler)]

The other point was (view spoiler)[ the dentist refusing to treat a young child in pain. (hide spoiler)]

(I will unspoiler these when more people have had a chance to finish the book.)

A relatively minor point was what bad parents Vivian & Bailey Snr were - in particular, Marguerite's dad. I did always feel Vivian loved her daughter but didn't understand her & was focussed on her own survival.

I knew about the inequities of education in the South for blacks and whites, but I was able to see the pain and hurt clearly described at the 8th graduation ceremony.

I'm about halfway through and, like Carol, I knew very little about the book prior to starting it and am enjoying it so far.

I think it can work for high school kids, but probably 15 - 16 years and older. My 13-year old is not mature enough to understand the rape scene yet.

Sending kids to be brought up by grandparents in rural areas were very common in South Africa under apartheid. Dad worked on the mines and Mum was a live-in domestic worker in the city who both earned money for the household in a rural place where the kids stayed. They would only see the kids for a few weeks over Christmas each year.

The graduation ceremony summarised the apartheid government's approach to education perfectly.

It seems strange that the USA protested apartheid when they had been, and in some places (like Mississippi) still were, doing the exact same thing.

I had said in a class I teach about banned/challenged books that I thought this book would be inappropriate for young teens for the reason you gave, Carolien. However, the teachers in the class disagreed stating that young girls need to know and understand inappropriate behavior long before they are 15.

I think it creates a very good opportunity to talk about appropriate and inappropriate behaviour and the consequences for young teens. My daughter is quite immature for her age, so I think some judgement would be required as to the best way to approach it.

It is also a very good book to talk about racism to teens. I cannot from the top of my mind think of an equivalent book by a South African author that would be equally appropriate to discuss racism effectively with teens. The closest may be Born a Crime: Stories From a South African Childhood.

I do think that your understanding of the book will change based on the age at which you read this.

There is a particularly good book for preteens about racism in Mississippi in the 1930's. It is a story about a black family trying to keep their land while being harassed constantly by some of the white neighbors. The main character is a young girl who has to "learn" the rules of surviving as a black and how she feels about the injustice she encounters. The book, Roll of Thunder, Hear My Cry by Mildred D. Taylor, won a Newbery Award when it was first published in 1977. This is the second book we are reading in my course. Even though it was written for children, adults will also enjoy and learn from it. Ms. Taylor is a black author who was born in Mississippi, so the story has that unmistakeable ring of truth.

Definitely going to take a look at this one, thanks so much.

Interesting points in this old blog post

Yes, I read this preparing for my class. I don't really have a problem with this one: "Again in 2009, the book was restricted to students with parental permission at the Ocean View School District middle school libraries in Huntington Beach."

I think that some middle school students might not be ready to read the book. Also, I think having competent and sympathetic teachers should also required.

What are the other books that you have included for your class, Emily?

I am or will be teaching two classes. One is called Banned/Challenged books. In order to attract more men to my classes, we are reading short books whose main characters are men. These include Fahrenheit 451, Of Mice and Men and Lord of the Flies. This technique has worked quite well!

The second class is African American Female writers of the 20th century. After I decided on what books to read, I then realized that 4 of the 5 books had also been banned and/or challenged. So it is working well for me to have similar themes. The first book we are reading is I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings, followed by Roll of Thunder, Hear My Cry, Their Eyes Were Watching God, Beloved and Kindred. The first four books have been challenged in high schools in the USA. Probably the last one would be if it were read in high schools.

☯E�������� wrote: "I am or will be teaching two classes. One is called Banned/Challenged books. In order to attract more men to my classes, we are reading short books whose main characters are men. These include [boo..."

These both look very interesting. I've read Kindred and Their eyes were watching God and enjoyed both of them. I'm planning on reading Beloved later this year.

I will also be reading Beloved soon. Did you have a hard time understanding the vernacular in Their Eyes Were Watching God?

It took me a while to get used to it, but once I found a kind of rhythm, I actually enjoyed it.

Yes, I found that reading it out loud helped in getting the rhythm.

The Color Purple also took me a while to get into the language, but again after a while it kind of fell into a pattern that I could manage.

I've been thinking about the way bannings work.

I found this blog post interesting.



I couldn't find what I was looking for - which was how often people call for books to be banned when they haven't read them.

Great article that I will use in my class. I haven't found any statistics about who wants books banned without ever reading them. I would assume it is pretty high. Perhaps a quick glance at a book can lead to that decision. I am using a book that I initially refused to read because the first twenty pages were filled with the 'f' word, which I thought was overkill. After the killing of George Floyd, I picked it up again and read it and it made quite an impression on me.

I know when I wanted to read Into the River when it was effectively banned in NZ I couldn't find a copy as my local library didn't have one. So I was in the position of trying to defend a book I hadn't read on general principles - for all I knew it was pure evil & it would corrupt young minds.

After seeing Émile Zola books on quite a few banned lists I now want to read them!

Reverse of what was intended. :D

That is such an interesting article, Carol. Under apartheid lots of books were banned in South Africa (some were published in the UK, because they couldn't be released in South Africa). Reasons were political (July's People, The World That Was Ours), but also moral outrage (anything with sexual content). These were not only not available, but you could be fined or jailed if found in possession of them. These days there are still education boards that sometimes remove a book from a curriculum (mostly arguing the content is not age appropriate), but other than outright hate speech, most books are available.

I suppose it is also a lot more difficult to enforce censorship with companies like Amazon providing such a wide selection of books and where you can change your domicile if necessary.

I agree that banning a book may just have the opposite effect in any case.

Actually, banning books make them more popular. For a long time, Boston, MA would ban books, mostly for obscenity. If your book was "Banned in Boston," then it got more attention and sold more. Walt Whitman's Leaves of Grass and Other Writings is one example of a book that was banned and then sold many copies when it was finally republished:

Desire Under the Elms was also banned in Boston and NYC threatened to shut down the play. As a result, the play became a bona fide hit!

I personally think that Ulysses would never be read today if it hadn't been banned for years.

That is so interesting! It's a good point about Ulysses, I've never quite figured out why it is so popular.

☯E�������� wrote: "There is a particularly good book for preteens about racism in Mississippi in the 1930's. It is a story about a black family trying to keep their land while being harassed constantly by some of the..."
White Lilacs is another good children's book on racism if I remember it correctly.

Thanks, Charlene, I'll look it up.